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Messages - mario

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General Discussion / Re: Help with mellotron (channel 221)
« on: March 06, 2022, 09:49:00 PM »
Hi Gilbert,
Thank you for detailed info, and the rar file.
I see that subdirs are all named with extra "-3" why is that?
They should simply contain a note (and possibly octave) e.g. "a#2".
The wav files are good to be named as they are.
Fingers crossed it will start working! 8)

Forgot to say that the "MIDI to USB IN-OUT Interface Cable" mentioned above can be actually used with Loopsynth, in order to connect it to PC and then control it from a DAW. Not all of these cables can send all MIDI messages very well, I think many struggle with SysEx, but should be OK with basic control - sending notes and CC messages to control parameters.

Hi, thank you for your question and detailed info about what you tried.

Unfortunately this does not work because the USB is there only for power and firmware updating, no other functionality is implemented.
The driver chip is not capable of emulating MIDI over USB (or any other advanced modes like for example mass storage), it is merely a "virtual serial port" (similar to for example Arduino development boards and many other). Normally there is no reason to connect Gecho to any USB port other than for powering.

Unless your controller also has the classic, opto-isolated MIDI (DIN5 or 3.5mm TRS Jack) output, you'll need a USB host. The host is meant for connecting a MIDI controller, it translates data from a USB MIDI device into the 2-wire MIDI signal.

By "USB host" I mean something like this:
NOT this, as this cable has the opposite purpose:

These are just examples, I haven't tested any particular one - soldered mine from these modules:

W10 does not seem to 'recognize' the Loopsynth (no sign under devices that it is plugged in) -  I read somewhere that a driver would be needed? If yes, where, which?

There are drivers but they are only needed for firmware updating / development. In theory a driver could be written that acts as a "virtual USB host" and creates virtual MIDI instrument in Windows, to integrate with various software or even to make the PC a host for external hardware controller, but writing such driver is beyond my knowledge.

Hi and welcome!

Thank you for sharing your work, Nyarlathotep is surely pleased too :D

In the recent update there are another two variations of Clouds (#342, #343) but I think the first one is a bit broken, it stretches the sound too much (some of its controls don't react, I guess). Still creates interesting textures after a while so I decided to leave it there.

You may also like the new polyphonic reverb, #322, which creates effect closer to a vocoder (as opposed to the monophonic Clouds). There is no true vocoder in Gecho - maybe there will be some day, however its requirements on the CPU are presumably higher, so we'll see. The basic soundscapes are playable by midi too, and if you turn down the background sample (i.e. water or forest) then only the incoming signal will be filtered by resonant filters, which creates something remotely similar to vocoder too. I see you tried granular already, perhaps it's harder to use that way, will probably not work well with speech but with monotonous singing, it should be possible to turin the voice into chords as well.

About the noise - can we rule out a ground loop? not sure if you meant "different powering" as trying various sources, or that every machine has separate and isolated power. From my experience, Volcas may have faint inherent buzzing, it depends on the power too. Maybe the auto-gain function in Gecho is amplifying it too much when nothing else plays (sounds like the buzzing is buried under the signal later?) Try to disable it, here is a searchable guide for all those options: (check the "input levels" paragraph that explains how to switch it off).

Hope this helps! :)

Feature Requests and Feedback / Re: midi control with relative message
« on: January 27, 2022, 09:53:49 PM »
Ah sorry you're completely right, I haven't noticed that the encoder is not working properly in the 3-byte message mode because the controller which I used has 14 potentiometers and only one encoder so maybe I just never assigned a function to it where it was obvious that it only goes between min and max values.

So the logic needs to be expanded as currently Gecho cannot tell a difference between 3-byte message from potentiometer, which can also returns the same max and min value, and 3-byte message from encoder. But it is easy to make this work, we simply need to look at whether any other values are transmitted in between; if yes, it's a potentiometer and we will parse the values as absolute, and if not, it's an encoder and we will parse the messages as increments by 1.

For now you'd need to send 6-byte messages to make this work, but looks like your controller does not support it?

I'll make sure that this is fixed in the next fw update, thank you for reporting the problem!

Feature Requests and Feedback / Re: midi control with relative message
« on: January 27, 2022, 03:46:39 PM »
Hi Jean-Luc,

For the infinite encoders the recognized format can be 3 or 6 bytes, if your controller sends 3 byte messages then you can use this for increment/decrement:

b0-xx-01 / b0-xx-7f

and in the case of 6-byte messages, it is:

b0-xx-40-b0-xx-3f / b0-xx-40-b0-xx-41

(xx = knob number).

I have two controllers with infinite encoders - Traktorino and Worlde Mini (which looks like a clone of Arturia Minilab, not sure if it sends the same messages). So Gecho was only tested with these two. I hope you can configure it to work well with your controller! 8)


Feature Requests and Feedback / Re: firmware 1.0.118
« on: January 21, 2022, 10:04:44 AM »
Hi Jean-Luc,
Thank you for your kind words!  8)
Glad to hear you figured it out, and that you like the new functions, enjoy!

Hardware Questions / Re: MIDI jack standard?
« on: November 02, 2021, 01:25:31 PM »
Thank you for your kind words, glad you like the loopsynth!

And that's an interesting question, we do not have such temperatures here so I do not have any experience with this. Most commercial components are rated at 0 to 70 degrees (as opposed to industrial or military components that can work at wider range), this does not mean that everything stops below zero but I think you may see the functionality slowly falling apart as the temperature goes down. Since it can survive water, it should be fine even if some condensation accumulates inside when temperatures change quickly (although it may stop working until completely dried up).

Components like regulators, CPU and sound chip produce a little heat but it is probably not much to keep them warm enough for long, maybe to make a difference of a degree or two (just guessing). Basically as in any device, nearly all input power is dissipated as heat (with exception of a tiny fraction that is transformed to the light or mechanical energy), the whole device takes less than 100mA, so at 5V that's below 0.5W which is almost nothing (good for batteries, not so good for low temperatures)... Please keep me informed if it froze or not :)

Hardware Questions / Re: MIDI jack standard?
« on: October 14, 2021, 12:16:37 PM »
Hi Paul,

Sorry about the slow reply, the notifications were not set up correctly so I missed your post.

Just wondering if the Gecholoop's 3.5mm MIDI jack is wired to the "A" or "B" standard. I'm assuming it's Type-A, but don't want to damage anything...

Yes you're right it is "A" standard, like used by Korg, IKMultimedia, Make Noise and others (I followed the specification here and decided for that group of devices, so for example the Uno synth can be connected directly with a 2.5mm to 3.5mm Jack cable).

Of course better safe than sorry but the risk of damage should be very low, Gecho definitely won't get damaged even if the other device short-circuited its output. The other way around, if the incoming signal was reversed, it will just do nothing, next to the octocoupler there is a protective diode and a current-limiting resistor. Quite often I mistakenly connected one device's output to another, forgetting changing the I/O selector switch, but nothing happened - the voltages and currents involved are very low.

Also, any update on the CV input capability? I've just got my hands on a Teenage Engineering OP-Z, and hope to start exploring the pair.

It is on the TODO list, I definitely don't want to leave this bit unfinished therefore it's still printed on the front panel, next to that switch. But for the next update I want to finish everything around the MIDI first, and that is almost done. I don't have the OP-Z, but if it has a MIDI output then there is plenty of things you could already do with this combination.

Happy to hear you enjoy the loopsynth, if you record something to share with us, please do not hesitate to do so!  :)


General Discussion / Re: New user, maybe dumb question about line-in...
« on: September 23, 2021, 12:01:41 PM »
Hi Guys, sorry for delay - we were moving home...

I recently bought A loopsynth, and I really love playing with it, it's a great, meditational tool that I can get lost in for hours, the creator is super friendly and was very nice to me even though I bought a second-hand device.

Thank you for your kind words! Of course, the support & warranty applies to 2nd hand too!  8)

I do have a question though, is it possible to set line in as a default setting over the mics for when setting a channel to add effects to other synths and stuff? I guess that this is somewhat going against the ethos?

Not at all, only it's a bit confusing - at some earlier version it used to permanently remember this setting once changed, but I was receiving too many emails about "my microphones stopped working" when someone accidentally pressed B4 and haven't realized what happened. Perhaps it should be a configurable thing, whether this is persistent setting or not... I guess it at least keeps the setting until powered off or reset, if I remember correctly.

Also channel 31 and 34 are great fun with line in.

Happy to hear that! :) By the way, patch manipulation controls in 34 are cumbersome, that's going to be improved in the next update.

Feature Requests and Feedback / Re: updating ?
« on: September 21, 2021, 11:11:49 AM »
Hi Jean-Luc,

Yes the update should come out soon but not sure yet how much of the sync functionality will be there - I'll try to add the analog tempo detection (useful with Pocket Operators) and MIDI clock parsing (e.g. from Keystep), which almost worked last time, but in its current implementation it is not a true "sync" yet, meaning that it only sets up the tempo while the unit is idle, but once you start playing, it does not update the tempo dynamically. So the timing might drift off after a while. In some channels it will be easy to add continuous syncing, but in some others there might not be enough CPU time left for this task. Anyway, in some channels - e.g. the basic soundscapes - it is perhaps not as useful anyway but I will try to add it to reverb, granular, and other more universal "effect" channels.

The next update will also bring some cool new upgrades to existing channels, for example the reverb now has polyphonic variant, controllable via MIDI, and it sounds very cool with external sound from some other device (for example mmxx t-ape).

I know it takes ages, but I'm still the only developer working here :) And have to switch between prototyping of new things, arranging production and building the units too. And because of elements shortages, time consuming redesigns are often needed when some chip disappears from stock globally... it happens often that we have something ready to manufacture but suddenly it is not possible anymore.

Also recently I've been distracted by moving home and company, which meant that for over a month not much was done except for bare minimum required to ship orders - but we're getting there.

Thank you for your patience and support!


Software (PC and Mobile Apps) / Re: V2 PC Connectivity
« on: August 07, 2021, 08:16:12 AM »
The problem is probably with "multiple target patterns". If you google that error message you get many examples what to try. Maybe it is incorrectly set path to the IDE:

Would I be better off using my Apple Mac to do this build and so on with rather than the PC I am using at the moment?

I don't know much about Mac, Espressif have a good forum where you can ask all questions: and there is setup guide available too:

But personally I believe that if you stick to PC it will be easier simply because more people use the ESP-IDF on PC and there is more advice available online.

Software (PC and Mobile Apps) / Re: V2 PC Connectivity
« on: August 03, 2021, 10:18:19 AM »
That's cool :) Yes I remember Delphi, or earlier Pascal in DOS which was the first language we used at school.

things like the key combinations of RST-B1 and so on driving me nuts (since RST turns the program off if you don't get the exact timing)

Yes that's an unfortunate combination, I've put it only for presumably less important / less often required settings, which one in particular do you use more often? It could be changed everywhere to more handy way where SET invokes a sub-menu, just like it's in the Dekrispator.

starting programs with line input mode too

At some point this setting was remembered in Flash, but I've been receiving a mail a day about "my microphones do not work anymore". :D But makes sense to allow it again, maybe add an option somewhere in config file if it should be remembered - the same with all input levels, for example when using Gecho + T-ape it's quite annoying to have to set them every time as the signal from T-ape is too strong.

I am right that if I totally brick it it is restorable just using the service menu B3 ?

There is only one binary handling everything so if it is missing or corrupted then it can't restore its own backup or flash an update from SD, you'd need to use USB to restore it.

trying to run the target 'flash'  (gecho not connected but would expect compile first then some kind of timeout)

That's correct expectation, but it looks your IDE does not issue the build command, just tries to flash the result? make flash is the last step, for the compile / build to happen you first need to run something like this:

Code: [Select]
python C:/bin/esp-idf-v4.0.3/tools/windows/ -j6 all
If you press Ctrl+B it should rebuilt all that's necessary, I don't use IDE to flash it as it will flash bootloader + partitions + code every time, and possibly at the wrong address, so instead I just do this in a separate MinGW window:

Code: [Select]
python C:/path/to/esptool/ --chip esp32 --port COM2 --baud 1500000 --before default_reset --after hard_reset write_flash -u --flash_mode dio --flash_freq 40m --flash_size detect 0x30000 C:/path/to/workspace/whale-v150/build/app-template.bin
Of course you could also modify the settings in IDE to match these parameters.

Software (PC and Mobile Apps) / Re: V2 PC Connectivity
« on: July 20, 2021, 02:01:01 PM »
Updating the Flash memory where config, firmware and background samples are stored can be done over the USB too, and is perhaps a lot handier. It requires a python script, which is part of the official IDE - you can find more info here.

Depending on what edition of v2 you have, you may or may not need to install drivers. Units with serial number below 1000 use FTDI chip and no drivers are needed, units above 1000 use CH340G and may need drivers (e.g. in Windows), here the same applies as for the v1 Gecho (but the app is not compatible).

If you need any help or advice I'm here 8)

Feature Requests and Feedback / Re: granular sampler
« on: May 18, 2021, 11:28:44 AM »
Hi Jean-Luc, no I was not aware of this problem, thanks for reporting it!

Indeed there is a bug and I was able to repeat it, in my case it restarts and sometimes indicates an error by blinking the whole row of red LEDs. This looks like pressing of B2 may be misinterpreted for "load custom chord progression" (e.g. what you can put in via channel 111) while there is none. When I had a chord progression defined, the B2 could be used to leave recording open. This should be easy to fix.

Pressing the B2 to "lock" recording again ruined the clean sample as the sound of the button was heard. Sensor would work better here. I wonder if it makes more sense to make it work in the same way as in #34 Clouds, where recording of new sound is enabled / disabled by triggering the S3 sensor repeatedly (and in Clouds that should be changed to S2 for more consistency).

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